Q of the Week - Worst tactics?

[Leon]

This week in 'Educating Leon':

What is the worst example of military strategy/tactics you can think of?  On any scale, from an individual event, to an entire war?

Surely trench warfare has to be up there, or have I been watching too much Blackadder?!

[lentulus]

Trench warfare actually evolved quite a bit through the war; by the "Hundred Days" tactics were as effective as their WWII version.  I see the real problems in that war from 1917 on as strategic and logistic, not tactical.

I am inclined to see the Prussian tactics at Gravelotte/Saint Privat as particularly awful.   They knew the formula for blowing away the French and still squandered their men in headlong attacks.  If either of the marshals of France present had had any balls, von Molke would have been handed is head on a platter.

From a strategic standpoint, the breakthrough attained by the Germans on the western front in 1918 had no follow-through because no-one knew what to do with it.

From a grand strategic  standpoint, Germany handing the Austrians a blank check in 1914 and not expecting them to spend it was shortsighted at best.

[Leon]

I am inclined to see the Prussian tactics at Gravelotte/Saint Privat as particularly awful.   They knew the formula for blowing away the French and still squandered their men in headlong attacks.  If either of the marshals of France present had had any balls, von Molke would have been handed is head on a platter.

From a grand strategic  standpoint, Germany handing the Austrians a blank check in 1914 and not expecting them to spend it was shortsighted at best.

Can you elaborate on these two for me?

[lentulus]

Can you elaborate on these two for me?

At Gravelotte (the German Right), Steinmetz kept feeding troops into the Mance ravine; if you have not seen pictures you might as well imagine a fortress ditch; the French were able to hold them quite effectively.  You have attended silliness like batteries advancing ahead of the infantry and into chassepot range to get slaughtered.  Bloody arrogance .  Moltke and the King were convinced they were defeated. 

On the German left, the Prussian Guard advanced without artillery support against the French positions at St. Privat; they were shot to pieces until the Prince ordered up decent artillery support.  I find I owe an apology to marshall Canrobert  who was the other French Marshal on the field and led a solid defense at St. Privat.  If Marshal Bazaine had ordered the Imperial Guard to attack  or Bourbaki had ignored him and attacked with the Guard *anyway* the Prussians might have been rolled up like a cheap pastry.  It certainly would have broken the myth of Prussian invincibility; a respectable French defeat in that war, let alone a victory, might have left us without a legacy of revenge to build WWI around.

.. I really want to get the SYW redy before I order the FPW, so I will stop there...

As far as 1914 goes, unless the Kaiser actually wanted to start WWI (and he might have) he should have told the Austrians to put the brakes on the Serbian thing when they accepted the Austrian ultimatum.

[Ben Waterhouse]

"Lord Raglan wishes the cavalry to advance rapidly to the front, follow the enemy, and try to prevent the enemy carrying away the guns. Horse artillery may accompany. French cavalry is on your left. Immediate."

[Dave]

The Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbour.

The French Maginot line.

The defence of Duffer's Drift   

[Dazza]

* Nik * leading tanks   

[Luddite]

Worst strategy?

Anyone that attacks Russia...pretty much going to go badly...
Anyone that attacks Afghanistan...even the Russians crawled out of there with the tail between their legs...


The 'War on Terror'. 
Sorry?  The war on what?!  OK, who are we fighting?  When do we win?  What strategy do we have that will defeat a word?



This one is going to be REALLY contentious...Britain's opposition to Nazi Germany in 1939.
OK. 
I know.
Bear with me.
Strategically this was a bad move.  It shattered Britain, bankrupted us and destroyed the Empire.
A disastrous strategy...but probably neccessary given the alternative...


Worst tactics?

That's a bit tougher. 

Probably situational and represented by the 'charge the guns' tactic of 'primitives' vs European armies during the Colonial era.  Here i'm thinking Zulus, Sudanese Hadendoa ('fuzzy wuzzies'), Highlanders at Culloden etc. 
This is also frighteningly similar to the WWI tactic of attacking trenches defended by machineguns...
Tactically poor.

In general, most of the tactics of the American Civil War, certainly the early period, were candidates for the worst.  The widespread use of Napoleonic tactics with effective rifled shoulderarms was...well..tactically poor... 

[Kebabman]

Have to agree with most of those Luditte.I do think your being a little harsh on our Imperial masters about the ACW,after all I thought some of the same mistakes were repeated in the FPW.

[lentulus]

Of course, Austria 1866 defines worst in most fields of military endeavor, mitigated frighteningly enough by the fact that they beat the Italians.

[nikharwood]

* Nik * leading tanks   

Yep - gets my vote 

[Fenton]

Worst strategy?


The 'War on Terror'. 
Sorry?  The war on what?!  OK, who are we fighting?  When do we win?  What strategy do we have that will defeat a word?

From what I 've seen some American Commanders say, and from the Old Bush administration ...I think its really a war against Satan...well thats what they say anyway

[Dave Fielder]

I once played a Naval Age of Sail game leading two RN Squadrons into to attack a French fleet stockaded in port. My 2i/c is known as 'Knuckles' in the local club, for which reason will become evident very soon. We were travelling in two parallel columns towards the enemy in fine form. Due to the scenario I was allowed to send a very simple written signal to his column, without any verbal comms allowed "Come right towards me, attack enemy". His reply "Which way is right?". The club house then goes silent as they watch this develop. I then asked the umpire if I could verbally ask him to hold up his right hand, the umprie agreed to this as he had a sense of humour. "Knuckles, hold up your right hand", "OK boss" - up went his left hand, he turned the wrong way and sailed off into the distance and the RN did not succeed that night. 

[Smee]

I think the witch doctor in an African country (cant remmeber which 1 it was) who told his followers/troops that the paste he had made them immune to bullets. then sent them in against mg posts win's my vote

[setterjaune]

Napoleon at Waterloo!!!
Dispersion of its troops and deficiency of the command