For King and Parliament publishing update

[fred.]

Mollinary, can I ask a rules question?

Are all units intended to be based the same? I'm particularly thinking about the smaller units like Forlorn Hope, Artillery or single hit cavalry units?

I'm assuming with the limit of 2 units per box, it doesn't matter too much. And probably the area of the unit's footprint should broadly correspond to the size of the unit. I suppose I'm asking how have you based these type of units?

I'm thinking of using 15cm boxes, with foot battalia made of 3x40mm square bases.

[mollinary]

Hi Fred,

The fun of a grid based set of rules is that it doesn't matter how you base your units, as long as they fit in the box -in fact, the two sides can be based entirely differently and they will still work!  Because my collection is ove twenty years old, my basing for FK&P reflected my original intent to try and adapt Volley and Bayonet. A standard foot battalia has  3 x 1 1/2" square bases, as does a standard horse unit. It hen put these in an mdf sabot  with a 5mm rim all the way around. It is on this that I attach my labels. My gun batteries are  2 x 1 1/2" Base, as are my small horse units, and Commanded Shot.   When we introduced the idea of Forlorn Hopes, I based some new figures up and went for something about 90mm long but 15mm deep. All these can Ben used on a 125mm or 150mm grid.  Your basing sounds perfect for a 15cm grid!

Best,

Mollinary

[fred.]

Thanks.

For the 2 base units, do you then sabot them on the same base as 3 units (approx 125mm) or smaller (approx 90mm)?

I like the idea of the smaller shallow Forlorn Hope units.

I was thinking about sabots, and thinking that a good bit extra at the back might be useful to allow for markers, so they can move with the unit, rather than being left behind. Probably a 125mm wide sabot, but 55mm or 60mm deep (for 40mm square bases).

[Steve J]

The Eagle did indeed land today, so I'm one happy (and relieved) bunny this evening . I know what I'm going to be reading over Easter .

[mollinary]

Good news, Steve!  Fred, I make the sabots to fit the units, so my artillery and two base units have sabots which are two thirds the width of the standard unit (+ the usual 5mm lip each).  The labels I stick on the back edge have, from left to right: a white section with the ammo marked (this will read, for Musket armed troops, say, M M M M) which can be marked off as used. Then a coloured block representing which army the unit belongs to. I find this quite necessary as otherwise it can get very confusing in these swirling cavalry melees!  Then, in the central block comes the name of the unit, it's status in brackets (V), (S) or (R), and whether Swedish or Dutch Style if Cavalry (S) or (D). Finally is another coloured block indicating the Brigade the unit belongs to. Brigade commanders (usually Colonels) have their own name and their Brigade colour behind their base. All a bit complex. If Leon is very kind, I can send him a couple of,photos to show what I mean!  

Mollinary

EDIT: Pics added!

Mollinary1 by Leon Pengilley, on Flickr

Mollinary2 by Leon Pengilley, on Flickr

[d_Guy]

If Leon is very kind, I can send him a couple of,photos to show what I mean! 

Mollinary

And in the interim, he is a photo Mollinary sent me:

  ...or I "borrowed" it from another site - I don't remember

[paulr]

Thanks Mollinary & Fred, a useful discussion

Another basing related question, from my limited reading on the ECW Musketeers seem to have formed in 6-8 ranks, I'm not sure how many ranks pike men formed in.
I'm looking at basing musket figures in 2 ranks. should the pike & command be 2, 3 or 4 ranks?

I like to look of Simon's units with a command group in front of the pikes, I probably won't have as many flags though

D_Guy, posted a very useful picture while I was typing this, I like the officers behind the shot

Are those 'Dutch' Horse on the far flank?

[fred.]

thanks d_Guy, I think those are the double width units mentioned in the rules (so 6 x 1.5 inch bases). They do look rather good, but you need a few figures for that!

mollinary - good info about the labelling and basing. If young Leon is doing something sensible like having an Easter break, then I'd be happy to post photos.

paul - I'd certainly go with more depth on the pike bases, probably 4 ranks, to go with 2 ranks of shot. Putting officers at the back does look good. Lots of flags is good too.

[mollinary]

Thanks Mollinary & Fred, a useful discussion

Another basing related question, from my limited reading on the ECW Musketeers seem to have formed in 6-8 ranks, I'm not sure how many ranks pike men formed in.
I'm looking at basing musket figures in 2 ranks. should the pike & command be 2, 3 or 4 ranks?

I like to look of Simon's units with a command group in front of the pikes, I probably won't have as many flags though

D_Guy, posted a very useful picture while I was typing this, I like the officers behind the shot

Are those 'Dutch' Horse on the far flank?

Hi Paul,

The photo d'Guy has posted is of the double sized units I created to do a demonstration game at COLOURS 2017. The horse unit in the background is, indeed, a double sized Dutch Style horse unit.  Regarding the basing, I wouldn't use mine as in any way gospel. Apologies to those who have heard the story before, but the basing date back to the 1990s, when I first started an abortive attempt to write my own rules, and then adapt the basing to Volley and Bayonet. I started making units on a 1:10 scale. All musketeers and pikes usually formed up 6 deep, for me, unless you are doing 1:1,this is too deep for miniattures. I wanted my pikes to look sufficiently massive, so I went with 1 rank equals one and a half in real life. So why are the musketeers only two deep? Well, when I started the armies, the only musketeer figures I could find were firing, and I thought more than two deep looked stupid! So I decided to take the moment when the rear three ranks had moved forward into the front three, to issue 'salvee' prior to a charge. At that time, there would have been two or more Musket stands to each side of any pike stand. When I changed rules, rather than rebase, I just made the unit one pike base per two muskets. Hope that makes sense?

[d_Guy]

To the best of my understanding by this time the musket and pikes were usually of equal depth (usually six rows). Of course I pay no attention to this because pikes look better with greater depth. My compromise is I use two pike rows for shot heavy and three (I add a strip with a single row of pikes) for standard and pike heavy. In actual practice I think that they would get formed up in the way that would give the best tactical application at the moment (but that's me). Mollinary will likely have a better answer.

[d_Guy]

Oops - posted over you Andrew, sorry!

[pierre the shy]

Very useful discussion on basing. I was originally thinking of using units on one 120mm wide base but I like the idea suggested by others of using several smaller 40X40mm bases to make up a unit as it gives a lot more flexability if you want to flick between a 1/3 pike 2/3 shot unit and a all shot unit (e.g. Montrose's Irish units).

Unfortunately our refight of the Battle of Montgomery that was to have been played today is now going to occur on Sunday. So I get a couple more days to pen a few verses of really bad poetry?   

[paulr]

Thanks for the info both of you, the idea of deeper pike for pike heavy units is one I'll keep in mind

Apologies Pierre the Shy for having to postpone our game, at least it was for something important, a large WWII Eastern Front multi-player game

We should probably wait till after our test game on Sunday to be planning our basing, but I think this is a strong indication of our enthusiasm for the rules

The flexibility of sabots and small sub-bases is attractive, it will require careful though when painting units
The look of mini-dioramas on larger bases also appeals

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

Battle of Montgomey is a classic, just watch the slope down from the castle to the river is a lot longer and steeper than people think!

[GrumpyOldMan]

Hello All

Does anyone have any opinions on whether an EARLIER time period for the rules could be used? I'm looking at French Wars of Religion-ish time period and just thinking whether I could use these or wait for the revamped Part 2 that would cover the Renaissance? From what I can see it is fairly ECW-mid 1600s specific.

Cheers

GrumpyOldMan