In poor taste?

[Nosher]

http://theminiaturespage.com/news/?id=1150466882

I couldn't help but think this is in poor taste given the death of a parent in Holland helping his kids football club out. My own personal thought is that whilst there are still thugs on the terraces sadly there as many on the pitch these days.

Is this in bad taste? Does it have a place in wargaming circles?

I know a week or so I was recollecting Golden Moments in Bloodbowl where a Star Player gets walloped, but is this just the same thing but real-life and therefore different?

I know I'm an ardent kissball knocker - I did love the game once , but I genuinely wondered what others views were and have a feeling it can be discussed reasonably here?


Leon, if it causes offence or gets out of hand I'm happy for the post to be pulled and apologise in advance.

[Kiwidave]

Why would you want models for football hooligans? 

[Leon]

I didn't see any problem with it myself, but I suppose it comes back to the 'Beyond the Pale' discussion we had on here quite a while ago now (http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,70.0.html).  Some folk might see it as wrong, but then you wouldn't buy the figures if that was the case?

If you got a load of police figures, you could turn it into a bit of a zombie game, with the hooligans representing the mindless moronic horde ( ) and the police knocking them out with water cannons... 

[Techno]

Why would you want models for football hooligans? 

I totally agree....What a very strange thing to make models of....Can't decide whether I find it distasteful or just plain weird.
Can't really see how it's got any relevance to wargaming though.
Mind you, it sort of highlights the firm that's made them.....Some sort of attempt at getting them noticed ?
Who knows.

Ah.... Leon's just made a good point !!

Cheers - Phil.

[goat major]

Don't Ainsty do a lots of 70s cult tv stuff - Sweeney etc. I guess they fit into that sort of genre.

And modern magic role play too - John Constantine has  had lots a few run ins with football hooligans in his time

[Luddite]

I don't see much wrong with it (except uninspiring sculpts).

I've long thought that civil riots would make for a very interesting 'war'game. 

Usually nobody dies, but it presents interesting tactical options for the police at least.

Why is wargaming actual war where people are butchered OK, but wargaming a football riot where a few people get beaten up not OK?

[petercooman]

I don't see much wrong with it (except uninspiring sculpts).

I've long thought that civil riots would make for a very interesting 'war'game. 

Usually nobody dies, but it presents interesting tactical options for the police at least.

Why is wargaming actual war where people are butchered OK, but wargaming a football riot where a few people get beaten up not OK?

+ to this!

We can play bloodbowl, the most ruthless football game off all, play dark futures filled with war,  apocalyptic wastelands where you butcher fellow survivors for resources, play horrorfests filled with zombies and command the SS divisions that committed so many warcrimes, but the thought of some hoolligans beating each other up is wrong?

[Hertsblue]

I don't see much wrong with it (except uninspiring sculpts).

I've long thought that civil riots would make for a very interesting 'war'game. 

Usually nobody dies, but it presents interesting tactical options for the police at least.

Why is wargaming actual war where people are butchered OK, but wargaming a football riot where a few people get beaten up not OK?

I think it's probably because it's too close to home. Nobody takes the fantasy stuff too seriously, and those of us who read history know that in reality it was a gruesome business, but it's all at arm's length. However, hooliganism - and not just football hooliganism - is all around us, witness the events in Manchester this weekend.     

[Luddite]

Not for me.

For me kissball and its hooliganism is fair game.  As are civil riots and brutal police actions (Orgreave, Battle of the Beanfield (particularly close to me), Battle of Trafalgar Square (i was there), etc.)

I think if we can game war scenarios where people are killed then scenarios where people get roughed up (and occasionally killed, usually by the police) shouldn't be a problem.

Leon referenced the thread i kicked off about this issue and i think its worth a re-read before this...

I think it's probably because it's too close to home.

...why is 'too close to home' important?

Why is it ok to wargame things that aren't 'too close to home'?

[Matt J]

I think the difference is when we war game we fight battles that are between soldiers. Civilians, as everyone knows, get caught up in historical conflicts but no one really games this.

police v hooligans is not war it is a civil action.

[Sandinista]

But Pony Wars is OK?

[Gran76]

Miners strike next with coppers like a roman legion and the miners like ancient brits.Scargill and Thatcher as commanders. Don't know how you'd do the miners banners though?

[sebigboss79]

The point in my oppinion is that moronic violence should not be promoted.

We are talking post-Daniel Nivel and in a situation where those people meet at amateur matches to beat each other up. Sports becoming a side-issue.

If you wanna get violent, join the army or a boxing club and beat up like minded people. Do not mess up sports.

[Luddite]

The point in my oppinion is that moronic violence should not be promoted.

That's the hobby done then...

Every war in history is full of moronic violence.

I think the difference is when we war game we fight battles that are between soldiers. Civilians, as everyone knows, get caught up in historical conflicts but no one really games this.

Partisans?

Volksturm?

Greek Hoplites?

Saxon Fyrd?

[Techno]

Good points again Luddite...

Cheers - Phil.