Early wips of Ancient Spanish

[Fenton]

Nice pics Nic...though I am still not sure why whenever people want to see 'Celts' they stick up pics of Irish people as there is no proof there were any Celts in Ireland..Trinity in Dublin did DNA tests of Irish people some years ago and found no  original 'Celtic' DNA at all

[nikharwood]

Nice pics Nic...though I am still not sure why whenever people want to see 'Celts' they stick up pics of Irish people as there is no proof there were any Celts in Ireland..Trinity in Dublin did DNA tests of Irish people some years ago and found no  original 'Celtic' DNA at all

Yeah - don't blame my anthropology though, blame Google 

I've added some American Celts now, just for good measure 

[Techno]

What !
I've got to go back and look at that thread again.
How tiresome.
Cheers - Phil.

[nikharwood]

What !
I've got to go back and look at that thread again.
How tiresome.
Cheers - Phil.

No-one's making you Phil   

[Techno]

No...True..
But I feel obliged because you've made the effort Nik.
Cheers - Phil.

[nikharwood]

No...True..
But I feel obliged because you've made the effort Nik.
Cheers - Phil.

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

Leave it with me - back in a minute...

That was worth it! 

[clibinarium]

Nice pics Nic...though I am still not sure why whenever people want to see 'Celts' they stick up pics of Irish people as there is no proof there were any Celts in Ireland..Trinity in Dublin did DNA tests of Irish people some years ago and found no  original 'Celtic' DNA at all

But current thinking on what "Celtic" means focuses culture, art and language, its not really a racial or genetic identity as such. As far as I can recall the genetic similarities are greatest between the Irish and the Basques.

[seano1815]

  drooling already my carthaginian army can't wait for them....they look great
keep up the good work Sean

[Luddite]

[thread derailment]

Actually the 'Celts' never existed, and the concept of 'Celtic' art or culture is invalid.

There never was a 'pan-European Celtic culture' traditionally expressed as such things as the 'La Tene' or Halstatt' cultures.

Its a complete myth. 

The modern idea of a 'Celtic fringe' to Europe is also a modern myth, or rather a modern reactionary political 'cultural movement' that has led to things like the Welsh and Scottish Assemblies (although Mel Gibson's dreadful 'Braveheart' movie had a lot to do with the Scots thinking they have some sort of national past).

Which is why this stuff still matters of course, because people today use history for current purposes.

As i said above the only legitimate use of the term 'Celt' is as part of the Celtiberian tribal name.

[/thread derailment]

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

Just don't mention this too half the football fans in Glasgow!!
and the Rangers fans can keep laughing!!
Might also be worth mentioning ttat where we loose the term historically, we have gained it in a geographic and geological sense, the Celtic Sea, the area of water south of Eire, encompassing the area of the Atlantic that borders the English Channel, The Irish Sea and the Bay of Bisquay and one of my best mates's phd studies! It was only formed in the last ice ages, so relatively modern event, while the isles of scilly were one land mass!

[Techno]

Something that's always puzzled me is....
Why is Glasgow Celtic pronounced 'Sell-tick' and not Kell-tick.
Or is it Kelltick north of the border ?
Cheers - Phil

[Duke Speedy of Leighton]

From Wiki -

Pronunciation of Celtic.
The initial consonant of the English words Celt and Celtic can be realised either as /k/ or /s/ (that is, either hard or soft ⟨c⟩), both variants being recognised as "correct" in prescriptive usage by modern dictionaries.[9]
The English word originates in the 17th century, taken from the Celtæ of classical Latin. Until the mid 19th century, the sole pronunciation in English was /selt/ in keeping of the treatment of the letter ⟨c⟩ inherited by Middle English from Old French and Late Latin. Beginning in the mid 19th century, Celtic revivalist and nationalist publications advocated imitating the pronunciation of classical Latin in the time of Julius Caesar, when Latin Celtæ was pronounced /keltai/. An early example of this is a short article in a November 1857 issue of 'The Celt', a publication of the Irish Celtic Union.
"Of all the nations that have hitherto lived on the face of the earth, the English have the worst mode of pronouncing learned languages. This is admitted by the whole human race [...] This poor meagre sordid language resembles nothing so much as the hissing of serpents or geese. [...] The distinction which English writers are too stupid to notice, but which the Irish Grammarians are perpetually talking of, the distinction between broad and narrow vowelsâ€"governs the English language. [...] If we follow the unwritten law of the English we shall pronounce (Celt) Selt but Cæsar would pronounce it, Kaylt. Thus the reader may take which pronunciation he pleases. He may follow the rule of the Latin or the rule of the English language, and in either case be right."[10]
A guide to English pronunciation for Welsh speakers published in 1861 gives the alternative pronunciations "sel´tik, kel´tik" for the adjective Celtic.[11]
The pronunciation with /s/ remained standard throughout the 19th to early 20th century, but the variant with /k/ seems to have gained ground during the later 20th century, especially among "students of Celtic culture".[12] On the other hand, the /s/ pronunciation remains the most recognised form when it occurs in the names of sports teams, most notably Celtic Football Club and the Boston Celtics basketball team.
The corresponding words in French are pronounced with /s/, and English Celtic was formed in imitation of French celtique. The corresponding German terms are Kelten and keltisch, not only pronounced as /k/ but even spelled with ⟨k⟩. This is a regular German treatment of names in Greek kappa, also observed in cases such Cimbri, Cimmerians, Cambyses, etc.[13] These spellings with ⟨k⟩ arise in the later 18th century. From the 16th to the early 18th century, the prevalent spelling in German was celtisch.[14]
The celt, a stone tool, has a completely separate etymology from Celt and Celtic. In English its sole pronunciation is /ˈsɛlt/.

[Techno]

Ahhhhh !

Ta - Phil.

[O Dinas Powys]

[thread derailment]

Actually the 'Celts' never existed, and the concept of 'Celtic' art or culture is invalid.

There never was a 'pan-European Celtic culture' traditionally expressed as such things as the 'La Tene' or Halstatt' cultures.

Its a complete myth.  

The modern idea of a 'Celtic fringe' to Europe is also a modern myth, or rather a modern reactionary political 'cultural movement' that has led to things like the Welsh and Scottish Assemblies (although Mel Gibson's dreadful 'Braveheart' movie had a lot to do with the Scots thinking they have some sort of national past).

Which is why this stuff still matters of course, because people today use history for current purposes.

As i said above the only legitimate use of the term 'Celt' is as part of the Celtiberian tribal name.

[/thread derailment]

Just to continue the threadjack!

By coincidence I was listening to an old "In Our Time" about just this subject the other afternoon.  Ok, so the episode is a decade old, but some of the ideas are definitely pertinent!  There was also an episode about Druids last week, haven't caught up with that one yet though.

If you're not familiar with In Our Time, it's a Radio 4 discussion program hosted by Melvin Bragg, homepage here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006qykl
The BBC have recently made every episode recorded available, so the archives are well worth a browse.

The episode on The Celts can be accessed/downloaded from here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/ioth/all  dated Thu, 21 Feb 02.  Search for Celt on the page.

Druids here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/iot

Cheers!

Meirion