Master lists for the Napoleonic French and Austrians!

[quasar42]

So, do any of our more knowledgeable Nap afficionado's have any info they can share to quicken up the process?  These are the ones we're looking at:

I have been wondering for a while whether your line grenadiers (http://www.pendraken.co.uk/NPF10-p5660/) could not double up as old guard (guard grenadiers and guard chasseurs) in campaign dress (i..e long trousers rather than gaiters), with the difference being that trousers would be painted blue rather than white. I am not certain though.

[quasar42]

By the way: A loading figure for the French (and some generals /marshals) would be much more urgent than the guard. My firing line is eagerly waiting for one.

[WeeWars]

We've been chatting with the designer about some of the outstanding items on the French lists here, but the main delay at the moment is the time required to research all the Guard types, to find out the differences in uniforms, and whether a single sculpt would cover two or more types? 

So, do any of our more knowledgeable Nap afficionado's have any info they can share to quicken up the process?  These are the ones we're looking at:

(PS, We've got Guard Grenadiers already, but I need to check on whether they are the Guard Fusiliers or Guard a Pied type.)

Would you like me to do this for you?

And their importance on the table? Well, I can't play my little corner of the Battle of Essling without the Young Guard.

[quasar42]

Based on Otto von Pivka, Armies of the Napoleonic Aera, the main differences between the various Guard types seem to be as follows:

- Difference of Chasseurs of the Guard vs. Grenadiers of the Guard: Chasseur bearskin has no plate, Chasseurs have "Polish cuffs", i.e. cuffs are pointed.

- Fusilier Grenadier: As Grenadier of the Guard but with shako instead of bearskin, shako with cords and side struts, brass plate, and plume. Pictures of Fusilier Grenadiers that I have are all in gaiters while for Grenadiers of the Guard I see both gaiters or long marching trousers. Personally, I like trousers better (more of a campaign look), but don't know if fusiliers had these.

- Fusilier Chasseurs: As Chasseur of the Guard (i.e. with pointed cuffs) but with shako like fusilier grenadier

- Tirailleur Grenadiers: short skirted blue tunic, Polish cuffs, shako seems to have been like middle guard

- Tirailleur Chasseurs: like Tirailleur Grenadiers, but pompon on shako instead of plume

Hope this helps. Others may have additions/corrections

[Rob]

There is tons of info on uniforms in our resources section. Here is another one for the French.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uniforms_of_La_Grande_Arm%C3%A9e#Grenadiers_of_the_Old_Guard

Guard Generalities:
Eagles were issued to all cavalry regiments and the 1st and 2nd Grenadiers and Chasseurs a pied only, eagles were not issued to other regiments.
Old guard grenadiers of horse and foot were about 6" taller than the line average height.
All shakos had eagle front plates (if that is do-able).

Young guard regiments could have officers in old or middle guard uniforms although this is not a rule.
http://library.worldtracker.org/World%20History/Napoleonic%20&%20Revolutionary%20Wars%20-%201792-1815/Osprey%20-%20Men%20at%20Arms%20160%20-%20Napoleon's%20Guard%20Infantry%20(2).pdf

There are some conflicting sources around the young guard during the 1809-12 period.

Guard Tirailleur Chasseurs, Guard Tirailleur Grenadiers
Uniform cut is the same for both. Light infantry style i.e. pointed lapels and cuffs, but the jacket tails are shorter than older guard or line units, just covering the rump. Shako pompom for both is a round ball without the tuft of line units, however there is variation here with some having a lentil shaped pompom and some also having a plume. This last seems to be to distinguish between the young guard regiments rather than for type and either method would be correct. No fringes on the epaulettes in 1809. Gaiters stop below the knee and trousers are covered by the gaiters. Sabres.

There is a difference in more than one reference that has the Tirailleur Chasseurs with fringed epaulets. This was certainly the case in December 1810 when the all the young guard regiments became either tirailleur (any of the former young guard regiments with grenadier in their title) or voltigeur (any of the former young guard regiments with chasseur in their title).

An ideal compromise would have three types. 1. No fringed epaulet and no plume. 2. No fringed epaulet and plume. 3. Fringed epaulet and plume.

This would allow any interpretation and would also mean you would not have to produce any young guard figures for 1812.
http://www.napoleon-series.org/military/organization/frenchguard/c_tirailleurs2.html
http://www.napoleon-series.org/military/organization/frenchguard/sthilaire/c_sthilaire9.html

http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://empire.histofig.com/Tirailleurs-grenadiers,1139.html&prev=/search%3Fq%3DGuard%2BTirailleur%2BChasseurs%2B1809%26start%3D40%26safe%3Doff%26sa%3DN%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1119%26bih%3D766
http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=fr&u=http://empire.histofig.com/Tirailleurs-chasseurs,1134.html&prev=/search%3Fq%3DGuard%2BTirailleur%2BChasseurs%2B1809%26start%3D40%26safe%3Doff%26sa%3DN%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1119%26bih%3D766

Guard Grenadiers a Pied, Guard Fusilier Grenadiers
Uniform cut is the same for both. Line infantry style i.e. square lapels and French cuffs, long jacket tails. Shako with plume for the fusiliers. Bearskin with eagle front plate and cloth top patch for grenadiers. Fringes on the epaulettes. Gaiters stop above the knee but may be covered by trousers on campaign. Sabres.

Guard Chasseurs a Pied, Guard Fusilier Chasseurs
Uniform cut is the same for both. Light infantry style i.e. pointed lapels and cuffs, long jacket tails. Shako with plume for the fusiliers. Bearskin with no front plate or top patch for chasseurs. Fringes on the epaulettes. Gaiters stop above the knee but may be covered by trousers on campaign. Sabres.

Hope that helps,

Cheers, Rob 

[Le Manchou]

I plan to play with 14 of my students the battle of Aspern-Essling in May 2014, so I would badly need the Baden and Hessian troops...and NOBODY proposes this range among the 10mm manufacturers. I am sure Weewars will join me to beg you to consider this range as a priority....after the centurion of course!

[Zippee]

yeah
see this thread http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,8417.0.html

Also Württemberg and Saxony

[cmuk]

Any news on when the rest of the range will be out - French with no guard is making me sad!

[Leon]

Any news on when the rest of the range will be out - French with no guard is making me sad!

The sculptor will be going back to the French once we've got the British and Prussians sorted for Waterloo.  The Brits are all here now (pics coming soon!) and the Prussians are being started this month.

[Techno]

Any news on when the rest of the range will be out - French with no guard is making me sad!

As that was your first post, cmuk.......A very warm welcome to the forum !!
Cheers - Phil

[Hertsblue]

Any news on when the rest of the range will be out - French with no guard is making me sad!

You do realise that if you field Guard they should be in divisional strength? The Imperial Guard, being a last reserve, very rarely fought at all (hence the Line's scathing nickname of "the Immortals" for them.) until the last days, when it was "every man to the pumps". 

[Zippee]

You do realise that if you field Guard they should be in divisional strength? The Imperial Guard, being a last reserve, very rarely fought at all (hence the Line's scathing nickname of "the Immortals" for them.) until the last days, when it was "every man to the pumps". 

Except, this being an 1809 range, the Old Guard are pretty much a must have for Aspern-Essling and the Young Guard are involved fairly constantly from their arrival.

And in 1809 I think we're talking brigade formations not division - anyway the elements of the guard were often committed a la Mouton  so a brigade strength fire brigade is perfectly apt.

[Hertsblue]

My point was, you don't get the odd random battalion wandering around on its own.

[Zippee]

True enough - I don't think the guard was ever a single unit formation after the conversion of the consular guard.

it is usually committed in regimental or brigade chunks - can't think of a single unit commitment off hand.

My point though was that 1809 is one of the few campaigns before 1814 where the guard was committed 

[cmuk]

You do realise that if you field Guard they should be in divisional strength? The Imperial Guard, being a last reserve, very rarely fought at all (hence the Line's scathing nickname of "the Immortals" for them.) until the last days, when it was "every man to the pumps". 

Look if I'm pretending to be Napoleon Ill decide when and where I commit my Guard, thank you very much

I play grand tactical, each base is a brigade.. I need my guard.