Japanese pikemen colors I the Sengoku Jidai period

[Bob51451]

Hi Guys,

I'm painting a Japanese army in the Sengoku Jidai Period, and the figures that I'm painting now are the pikemen.  I'm having a hard time in finding the colors to use for the Different clans. I would think everyone in the clan (at least most of them) would be covered in the color of the clan. I have seen some pictures with the color red for the cloth and the armour was black. But I also have seen pictures with in a unit of men, there were all different colors, red, white, blue, brown, green, and so on. I don't want the army to look foolish because the colors are all wrong. I'd. like to be at lest in the ball park with the colors. Can someone help me, I'm not the greatest painter, but I would like to give it a try. ( Being at 70 years of age, LOL)
Well stay well all,

Bob51451

[clibinarium]

I wouldn't worry too much about uniformity in Sengoku armies. While sometimes troops were dressed alike it was only really when wealthy Diamyos did it to show off. Ii Naomasa's red devils being an example.
You might see a degree of uniformity in the armour, as some of it was issued from central stores, particularly in the later part of the 16th century onwards. Generally armour would be black or dark brown/red. Clothing could be a variety of colours, but fairly muted. Samurai would have sometimes used fancy armours and colourful clothes, the Ashigaru probably almost never (there are exceptions, but they were when their lord wanted to splash some cash like the contingent sent to Korea with very tall conical gold lacquered helmets, though these probably weren't worn in the field).
Keep the armours dark and you won't go too far wrong. A Japanese army's colour comes from its banners and sashimono.

EDIT- forgot to write- the lacing of armour can be very colourful, especially in the earlier period.

[fred.]

Here are some of mine (pre-sashimono)



I went black / dark grey for armour. I've gone pretty uniform on colours of trousers and sleeves, which probably isn't the most historically accurate, but it makes nice looking units! I also find it much easier to paint units this way.

I have found the Ashigaru very quick to paint.

The Samurai take more effort - but you don't need that many of them!

[fsn]

[FierceKitty]

I love and collect Japanese prints, but do remember that they're far from contemporary with their historical subjects.

[mmcv]

Some good information on heraldry here:

https://www.kingsfordminiatures.org/artwork

And this thread:
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/topic?url=https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/japanese_history/samurai-heraldry-illustrations-t1148.html&share_tid=1148&share_fid=2066824&share_type=t&link_source=app

As mentioned elsewhere though, actual colours of troops could be variable and other than a few notable mentions, such as the red Li and black Date, if you stick with reds, yellows, browns, blacks, greys, whites, blues and greens you'll not go far wrong!

My plan is to have lots of generic looking units then go with something a bit more uniform on some of the well known clans.

[DecemDave]

There you go Bob.  two ready made army lists.  At 1:1 should keep you going for a while.      

[Bob51451]

You Guys are really great, thanks so much... !!! All I need are a few more packs to finish a small army of eight ( 8 ) bases. ( I using the Impetus rules, and it should be fun painting and making these dioramas out of the bases. FUN, FUN, FUN.
     Once I fish them I will take pictures of them ( 10 mm figures). Stay well all,

Bob51451

[mmcv]

You Guys are really great, thanks so much... !!! All I need are a few more packs to finish a small army of eight ( 8 ) bases. ( I using the Impetus rules, and it should be fun painting and making these dioramas out of the bases. FUN, FUN, FUN.
     Once I fish them I will take pictures of them ( 10 mm figures). Stay well all,

Bob51451

Looking forward to seeing your photos! They are fun to paint. I'm sorting out my next couple of batches at the moment, some more early feudal as well as sengoku.

Good luck with attaching the sashimono, can be a bit fiddly, but looks good when done.

[Bob51451]

Hi Everyone,
I have a question, within a army of the Sengoku Jidai Period,  were there different clans within an army, and if so, would their Sashinons banners on their backs be all different, that is for their clan that that represented on the field. I am beginning to make the Sashinons for some of my units ,another question, did all units have Sashinons in a clan, or did certain units like pikemen,or longbowmen not have them.
   Well, I wish everyone to have a great day ! And Happy Painting !!! everyone.

Bob51451

[Ithoriel]

Yes, there might be several clans within a samurai army and, to make it worse, samurai might wear their own banner on their back rather than the clan banner.

This is either a nightmare, if you are a stickler for detail.

Or, a license to let your imagination rip, if you are more of a free spirit.

As to who wore sashimonos and who didn't, I suspect both samurai and ashigaru tended not to earlier on, then more and more samurrai did and finally some ashigsaru followed suit.

My 3mm samurai have sashimonos, my ashigaru don't. Entirely because that's how the models are moulded.

[mmcv]

Yeah as Ithorial said, quite a mix of sashimono and clans and personal heraldry with it becoming more widespread as the period advanced and more structured towards the end of the period as armies got bigger and more organised beyond the loose feudal clans seen for much of the history. Lots of room for imagination.

Do you have a particular clan or conflict in mind? As that would indicate the period and mix somewhat.

I'm generally going with between half and a third with sashimono as what j thought was a reasonable average, but if you want to save yourself the pain it wouldn't be incorrect to only have a few samurai and ashigaru leaders with sashimono. Ashigaru would just have their clan symbols (typically white banner with black mon, sometimes coloured banner with white mon) while samurai may have clan mon, or variations of it, their own mon, their name, slogans, designs, etc. So quite a mix.