Recce points question

[Amra]

Hi All,

I'm not sure if I'm doing the points correctly , so some help please

1x 222 (70), 1 x 221 (55) plus a motor bike squad . Is the motorbike squad 45 points and they dismount as a base or is it a Recce infantry squad (60) plus the motorcycle (45) ?

Also do I command them with a CHQ CV9 (90) ?

This is for DAK ,by the way

Finally is a legal/reasonable Recce force to add to my motorised infantry battalion?

Thanks

[Lord Kermit of Birkenhead]

There is a recce platoon at regimental level, but DAK may not have had them given it's manpower shortages.

[Amra]

Thanks mate,I'm not sure what you mean though
DAK had the Aufklarung ( Recce mechanised company ) in each Division
Mark Bevis OOB for 15th Panzer Division has a Regimental Recce platoon in a motorised infantry regiment plus a Recce battalion
The rules army list for the DAK include them
Anyway, assume I'm using them ,have I done the points for the Recce motorcycle platoon correctly ?

[sean66]

the list states
Platoon Recce 60 Pts
Motor cycles 45 Pts
I would say if they are on Motor bikes make two stands (one with them on Motorcycles, one as infantry) then they can dismount. but id pay for both.
if you have troops in half tracks you still have to pay for the vehicles within your list.
further down the list a normal Motorcycle would only cost 25Pts.
Regards
Sean

[fred.]

One thing to be aware of is that in the BKC lists Recon units are quite expensive compared to equivalent normal units, because they have the special recce rules.

Which is good if you want to add a couple of recce elements to a force. But if you want to field a larger recce force to represent a recon battalion then you will want to field most of them as normal units - not least so they can fight normally, but also to get them at a cheaper points cost.

[sultanbev]

German mechanised units were incredibly flexible, so you can take any recce CHQ and allow it to command any three-four recce platoons from any other company within that Recce Battalion.

Or alternatively, you could, as suggested, attach a single recce platoon to an Infantry Battalion HQ. That would be perfectly legit.

So looking at List BKC2, you could have:
from 33rd Recce Battalion
1st Armoured Car CHQ CV9 90pts
1x Sdkfz 222 90pts
1x Sdkfz 221 75pts
1 recce infantry platoon cross attached from 2nd company: 60pts
mounted on motorcycles: 45pts
= 360pts
All these would have the recce special rules. If you don't want them to have those special recce rules, subtracting 20pts from each stand seems to be the common number.
Personally I would add the 3.7cm PAK platoon with a Kfz69 truck to that company to give it some reasonable firepower. (+75pts = 435pts)

The you could form a second command using the 2nd Motorcycle Company CHQ CV9 90pts
1x Sdkfz 222 90pts
2 recce infantry platoons 120pts
mounted on motorcycles 90pts
1x 7.5cm IG + truck from 3rd company 100pts
(490pts)
Then use the recce Bttn HQ as overall CO at CV10 (150pts) with the pioneer platoon from the 3rd company and MMG platoon from 2nd company directly under command (+200pts) with any points left over to add a panzer platoon &/or ATG &/or flak platoon. It was quite usual to attach an 88mm flak gun section, a panzer platoon or company, and a full light flak or towed ATG company to a recce battalion.

There you have it, Recce Kampfgruppe Amra, November 1941, North Africa
at 1275pts + any attachments

So yes, the recce platoon on motorcycles - if you buy both then the infantry can dismount - so you would need models for both. Alternatively you could just buy the motorcycles (at 45pts they include the sidecar mounted MG34s) but they wouldn't survive for long I wouldn't have thought. Or you could just buy the infantry stands but then they'd have to walk....

Mark

[Big Insect]

An alternative route is to make them all Recce Support instead of Recce.

They cost the same as Recce but you can use the Recce Support rules, which allows you to designate some (all) of them to behave as normal units in specific game turns.
This works well for the larger armoured car type recce formations. It allows them to move like recce in one Game turn (for example) and fight like normal units the next.
The issue with making them all Recce is that they cannot initiate any combat actions, they are restricted to the various Recce functions only.

It is more complex to play but the Recce Support rules were specifically designed to allow these types of formations to be portrayed more realistically - worth checking it out.

You could leave the motorcycle recce unit as a pure Recce unit - and that can function in a more reconnaissance orientated roles. So it can boost your CHQ's CV for example - or spot for other troops or reconnoiter terrain etc.

I hope that makes sense?
Cheers
Mark

[Amra]

Fantastic,thanks all
That makes sense &Kampfgruppe  Amra sounds awesome 😎 

[sean66]

If using off table support, and or Air support.
the Kampfgruppe will need an FAO, and FAC both for 45 Pts each.
these can then use the recce units as forward eyes to call in both airstrikes and off Table artillery up to 60cm from the recce unit (not the FAC/FAO)
so two Stuka B and a FAO will add 165Pts
Regards
Sean

[Amra]

Great thanks ,
I also have the Storch model because they're cool ,so I need to work out aerial recon as well !