BKCIII German Vehicles 1944

[Astronomican]

Hi!

Curious as to why the 75/L70 Panther has 6 attack dice when the 88L71 Jagdpanther/Tiger II has only 5?
The 88L71 has far greater armour penetration than the 75L70 - 237mm versus 194mm when firing APCR (courtesy of Gentz).

No entry for the Jagdpanzer/IV(A) or (V) - the 75L70 versions built by Alkett (A) and Vomag (V).

Vehicles with the same primary weapon have different values, for example:-
Panzer 38T Flakpanzer AP:2/50 AT:1/50
Sdkfz 222 AP:2/60 AT:-/--
Auflarungspanzer 38T AP:2/60 AT:1/40
Sdkfz 234/1 AP:2/60 AT:2/60
Sdkfz 250/9 AP:2/60 AT:1/30

All of the above have the same 20mm cannon, yet have a variety of values for AP and AT.
Also, why does the 20mm cannon, in some cases, have two different ranges for AP and AT attacks?
Its the same gun firing the same ammo for both types of attacks, so why does an AT attack have a shorter range than an AP attack?

[Hengist]

Not wishing to answer for Ian on this, but

Is it the same ammo?

The AP particularly on the 250/9 would include the MG, AT just the 20mm.. OR were their different cartridges for 20mm HE as opposed to the AT rounds?

Odd , doesn't always mean wrong.

Steve.

[Ithoriel]

My understanding is that the 222, 234, 250/9 and 38T Auflkarungspanzer are the same turret, mounting the same gun, firing the same ammo.

There are so many weird decisions in the armylists that I do know something about that I wouldn't trust the other amylists as far as I could throw them ... into the teeth of a hurricane .... with my hands tied behind my back!

[weredoomed2003]

I agree - something seems to have gone really wrong with the army lists.  Shame as the rules changes and the presentation are really good (imho).  But the army lists are so full of omissions and strange values that it's starting to mske me feel that the rule set is a bit if a let down. (Probably as I was really looking forward to it).  Can't see why the values have been changed from BKC2 as we never had a problem with those...

[Dr Dave]

It's not just the German and Russian lists. The British stats have gone odd as well.

[Hengist]

If I were to hazard a guess, I would suggest that there is a points calculator algorithm somewhere, and the 'special' items, 'Lumbering' 'restricted arc' etc have been pointed in a way that doesn't work with some vehicles and Guns.. In another thread I see the 57mm US AT Gun(10), being pointed less than the 37mm(15) despite its stats being much better. And the difference seems to be one 'special', which IIRC was 'lumbering' or 'restricted arc'

Steve of Oz

[weredoomed2003]

I think that's right - same for the Russian 45mm and 37mm ATgun- no problem that the 45mm is less points as it has a restricted arc, and the 37mm with slightly worse stats but not restricted arc is slightly more.  That seems logical. 

[sjb1001]

The issues are not so much the points for me as the inconsistencies and the outright mistakes like KV-85 AA platforms, JS-II with shorter range then HMG, Panzer IV armour dropping from 1940 onward. The more I read the rules the more I think these need a major revision in the stats rather than a bit of errata.

[Superscribe]

Please see new post: http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,15931.0.html

[Itinerant Hobbyist]

See Leon's post regarding this
http://www.pendrakenforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,15956.0.html