Italo-Turkish & First Balkan Naval Wars

[paulr]

I am currently researching the Italian, Ottoman, Greek and Bulgarian navies from 1911-1913 (Italo-Turkish War & First Balkan War)

I am going to use 1/3,000 Navwar models and have found most of what I need for the larger ships and several of the smaller ships

I have found 'close enough' substitutes for most of the smaller ships

I not found substitutes for the following:

Italian

• Protected cruiser Piemonte
• Torpedo ships Agordat and Arethusa
• Gunboat Volturno

Ottoman

• Torpedo Gunboat Peleng-i Deryâ
• Torpedo boat Berk Efşan
• Gunboat Nur-ül Bahir (I haven't found a picture of her yet)

Bulgarian

• Torpedo gunboat Nadezhda

Any suggestions for 'close enough' substitutes would be warmly welcomed.

Pierre the Shy is tempting me to get the Astro-Hungarians as well, which I may do. And extend to WWI which is probably a few too many ships

[sunjester]

Sounds interesting, I'd like to see pictures once you have finished!

[Leman]

Have you tried Tumbling Dice? They have all sorts of ships in all sorts of scales.

[Ithoriel]

Have you tried Tumbling Dice? They have all sorts of ships in all sorts of scales.

Only 1/2400 and 1/4800 scale ships to the best of my knowledge but it's possible a 1/2400 torpedo boat might make a 1/3000 cruiser or similar.

Mick Yarrow has a range of 1/3000 naval stuff, no idea if there's anything that would do in his line.

http://www.spanglefish.com/mickyarrowminiatures/index.asp?pageid=188423

[paulr]

Thanks, pictures will be posted in due course 

But I haven't finalised my order(s) yet.

Tumbling Dice don't do 1/3,000 and Navwar have almost all I want in 1/3,000

I've had a quick look at Mike Yarrow, he certainly does some different ships. I will have a good look later

[fred.]

Might be worth a look on Shapeways too - probably too expensive for a whole fleet, but a good way to fill in some unusual ships.

And I tip my hat to you, at choosing a fantastically obscure period!

[GrumpyOldMan]

Hello paulr

Have a look at http://www.wtj.com/store/.

Has a lot of pewter and fast prototype (3D printed?) plastic 1/3000 pre-dreadnought ships that might be handy.

Doesn't list the Piemonte but has other protected cruisers.

Cheers

GrumpyOldMan

[Lord Kermit of Birkenhead]

Also Navwar - although their ordering system is primitive....

[Ithoriel]

Just ordered some galleys for "Poseidon's Warriors" from Navwar. Sent the order off on Wednesday of last week and the parcel arrived Monday. Primitive ... but effective!

[paulr]

Good to hear your order was so promptly dealt with

Last time we ordered from Navwar they were having trouble with their fax machine but once the order was received it was also promptly processed

I made some progress on my research last night finding suitable stand ins for Piemonte and Agrodat

[Ithoriel]

Good to hear your order was so promptly dealt with

Last time we ordered from Navwar they were having trouble with their fax machine but once the order was received it was also promptly processed

I made some progress on my research last night finding suitable stands for Piemonte and Agrodat

Second class post, in both directions, got the job done. Still feels positively Dickensian but, hey-ho, if I want the items ...

[Elliesdad]

Some of the (major) companies we deal with at work often say they "don't have email" (they clearly do - but only when it suits them) but say they can send and receive faxes.
I did say to someone recently that they could try contacting us via semaphore but the quip was entirely lost on them.
That's today's younger generation for you...

Geoff

[paulr]

Some of my background reading has given me the perfect "what if" to justify the Austro-Hungarian ships

In the first few days of the Italo-Turkish war Italian ships of the 'Division of the Torpedo Boat Inspector', including the battleship St Bon, were bombarding the Ottoman coast in the southern Adriatic and fought the battle of Prevesa. The Austro-Hungarians were so worried about the impact on already unsettled Albanians and the rest of the Balkans that they warned Italy that they would take direct naval action if the war was not confined to Africa. They also moved a division of battleships south to reinforce their diplomatic warning

Due to communications delays Italian torpedo boats were still bombarding the Ottoman coast days later. Also the Austria-Hungarian Army Chief of Staff end up resigning because he could not convince the Emperor to invade Italy while it was preoccupied with Tripoli.

Might be worth a look on Shapeways too - probably too expensive for a whole fleet, but a good way to fill in some unusual ships.

And I tip my hat to you, at choosing a fantastically obscure period!

It looks as though I will be able to find stand ins for most if not all the ships I'm after

It is a fascinating period with some really different ship designs and some interesting small actions and plenty of what ifs for larger actions. For example the main Ottoman fleet was returning from a training cruise to Beruit when war was declared. Fortunately for the Ottomans one of the steamers dispatched found the fleet and warned them that war had been declared allowing them to avoid the Italian forces

[paulr]

I finished working out the last of the "stand ins" or substitutes last night

I now have an order of 149 ships including the Austro-Hungarians

I've started researching ship colours, KTravlos' Hellenic Maritime Museum pictures were very useful

My initial thoughts are:

Greek

• mid to light grey
• at least one source claims black for TBs which contradicts the models at the Hellenic Maritime Museum

Bulgarian

• mid gray

Ottoman

• TBs dark brown or 'black'
• Larger vessels light khaki

Italian

• TB 'black'
• Larger vessels dark blue grey
• I'm tempted to do some in peace time colours, 'black' hull, white upper works and ochre funnels

Austro-Hugarian

• TB 'black'
• Larger vessels dark green

These are very much initial thoughts and any information welcome

[fsn]

149! That's a big fleet or three!