Shield Walls

[fsn]

[Fenton]

Also with shield walls there tended to be several ranks behind the first thus adding weight of numbers and the rear ranks being able to thrust over the top of the front rank

I have been involved in a couple of shieldwalls 4 ranks deep and once they collide the weight of both sides tends to naturally lock the shieilds in place  especially when there overlapped

[Westmarcher]

When I watched these videos, I have to say I wasn't fully convinced (I must also confess, I was also getting bored). Other than perhaps the odd image (e.g., some seamstress' idea of a shield wall on the Bayeaux Tapestry), does anyone know what the historical sources for the drills and the arrangement of shields in these 'walls' are? Or is it mainly conjectural? (I'm not saying there are no historical sources, I'm simply not a Dark Ages expert).

I understand that the most ubiquitous weapons were spears and hand axes. Swords used up more metal and were more expensive to make than spear heads and axe heads, so you were more likely to be chopped by an axe or stabbed by a spear than stabbed or slashed by a sword. It seems to me that 'locking' your shield with the left side overlapping the right hand side of your left hand neighbour's shield restricts your freedom of movement when up close, hand-to-hand combat occurs. Wouldn't it be better to have the right side of your left hand neighbour's shield overlap the left hand side of your shield? Also, it seems to me that feet and legs are vulnerable to chopping and stabbing, and a one handed axe is good for swinging over the top of a shield wall and onto heads, necks and shoulders.

Anyway, here are some links to a site that explores hand-to-combat techniques in the Dark Ages which, if not covering shield walls per se, seems to me to highlight some flaws in some re-enactors' thoughts regarding shield walls and which may be of interest to Dark Age fans. As you will see, many of the techniques are taken from one-to-one combat in the Viking Sagas. Within the site, there are also articles on Helmets, Mail etc.

http://www.hurstwic.org/history/articles/manufacturing/text/the_shape_of_viking_combat.htm

http://www.hurstwic.org/history/articles/manufacturing/text/viking_shields.htm

Plus another:-
https://wuhstry.wordpress.com/2014/09/09/the-viking-axe-and-spear/

[Leman]

As I understand it, a favourite manoeuvre was to bring the axe head down over the top edge of the opponents shield and pull the shield downwards to expose the warrior.

[Techno]

That's the method Uhtred tells about in the Bernard Cornwell books. 

Cheers - Phil

[Westmarcher]

Not attempting to come up with some ground breaking insight here, chaps. Posting this for entertainment only. OK, the following footage is from a computer game and so there are a lot of things that are not quite right, shall we say. However, some of the action is quite good and kind of looks 'right' also, particularly as it is mostly seen from a 'helmet cam' perspective and you are right in there and part of the mayhem. Watch the green shields get stamped.

[Wulf]

My old Re-enactment group were asked to assist the police with training once. After mentioning caltrops for the horses and bin lids (it was many years ago) for a boars-snout shield charge they were informed it wasn't to be quite such a physical training day...

[urbancohort]

Thanks to all for taking part in the discussion. Very illuminating.

[JeffNNN]

Talking to a wargamers friend who joined the Police after University (well actually after a couple of years teaching in inner city Brum. He decided that as all he was doing was riot control, he might as well have the uniform and the kit) and asked him what would happen if we used Theban tactics against a police line. The response was pretty unprintable but suggested it would work pretty well.

I also took part some years later in "Green Hackle" which pitted Sandhurst cadets (playing Northern Ireland security forces) against a horde of Territorials as the various sides. At one point that included a shield wall, which was taken apart when the funeral procession used the coffin as a battering ram.

[Leman]

 

[Heedless Horseman]

I also took part some years later in "Green Hackle" which pitted Sandhurst cadets (playing Northern Ireland security forces) against a horde of Territorials as the various sides. At one point that included a shield wall, which was taken apart when the funeral procession used the coffin as a battering ram.

Also    One would hope that first class tactical thinking was rewarded! lol
But, when you think about it, such a 'pry bar' could have been useful in some circumstances...if a shield wall was as rigid as is often assumed. Personally, I think that most 'battles' were more like large scale skirmishes, with action much more fluid than often depicted. Given the small size of most warbands of 'carls', it would be too easy to outflank a single shield wall as supporting 'troops' would be so much weaker than armoured warriors. Possibly 'cores' of warriors with support, manoeuvering and reacting to opportunity would make more sense. (Would make for much more interesting game, anyway, than ' line up and role the dice'...something that has put me off 'ancients' or 'Dark age').
"Shield Wall" seems a little bit more like something that you would read in 'The Sun'...stirring stuff from the skalds in the feast hall before or afterwards.
But, 'horses for courses'...some battles will have required different tactics than others. Bigger battles may have just needed to be a long, hard slog...and Hastings had to have a wall to prevent cavalry penetration.
So, just fight your fights as they had to...they wanted to win...and live for the rewards.

[urbancohort]

Heedless Horseman, that is pretty much what I was thinking. You have just described it so much better than I did. Given that I believe that Hastings was fought slightly away from the preserved field, which would have been too boggy for Norman cavalry to operate effectively, I think the Saxon line was further East by a few hundred yards, astride what is now the A21 probably with the centre between the church and the mini roundabout(!) This would also have been more effective in preventing a Norman out flanking manoeuvre hence their greater reliance in archers. It would also mean the shield wall would potentially have a smaller frontage which might explain Harold's inability/unwillingness to commit all forces to the charge of the fyrd when the had the Norman army retreating. It might have been that they were fighting in a much narrower space than we have traditionally though.

Anyway, I am rambling now. Thank you for contributing to this discussion.

[Leman]

Just out of interest, the first series of The Last Kingdom is now on Netflix (always supposing you can cope the various groups being put into a sort of 'uniform' for the uninformed).